link/move/copy dialogue

[igoldsmid]

In the link/move/copy dialogue (pop up window) - it would be nice to be able to perform a control/click operation in order to link or copy to more than one parent at one time.

Thanks...

[Leoram]

Yes. I 2nd this. In some ways this suggestion could be better than the one I posted here: http://www.kinook.com/Forum/showthread.php?threadid=3077&highlight=move (point 2) asking for enhancement to the Link/move box.

[igoldsmid]

thanks for the support Leoram.

I think it should make sense to other users & Kinook?

Cloning/logical linking is one of UR's key features - so to make it easy and productive to create several/many of them for any particular Item or selection of Items in one simple operation is a good thing I hope.

[quant]

good idea ... BUT

this whole link/copy dialogue is only a poor imitation of a full-featured second data explorer pane (which is badly needed IMHO) ... so rather than improving this dialogue I'd like to see second data explorer and this suggestion would apply there as well ... http://www.kinook.com/Forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3137

[igoldsmid]

hi Quant - yes I hadn't noticed your earlier post. Great idea!

[Leoram]

Originally posted by quant
good idea ... BUT

this whole link/copy dialogue is only a poor imitation of a full-featured second data explorer pane (which is badly needed IMHO) ... so rather than improving this dialogue I'd like to see second data explorer and this suggestion would apply there as well ... http://www.kinook.com/Forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3137
Well, not exactly. I think you are missing something quant.

A second data explorer would be a good feature also and I think it can cohabit with the Link/Move dialog. Let me explain:

1. UR has a feature "Option to prompt for import location when importing from another application" that uses the Link/Move dialog. This is at least one use of the dialog that a second data explorer couldn't imitate.

2. There might be more that one circumstances where the user wouldn't want to clutter UR layout with another instance of the explorer.

3. The Link/Move dialog has an idiosyncrasy of its own (to my understanding) when dealing with linking or copying stuffs.

4. Other uses I can't come up with now :).

[quant]

Originally posted by Leoram
1. UR has a feature "Option to prompt for import location when importing from another application" that uses the Link/Move dialog. This is at least one use of the dialog that a second data explorer couldn't imitate.
Apart from the add/rename in that dialogue, it would be much better implemented as a simple mouse pointer with new item name flying next to it, pressing ctrl/shift the standard modification would change the mouse pointer to "store/link", pressing enter would confirm, pressing esc cancel the whole operation. Simple as that, no need for big import dialogue.

Originally posted by Leoram
2. There might be more that one circumstances where the user wouldn't want to clutter UR layout with another instance of the explorer.
who says you have to have it open all the time? Moreover, standard pane can be floating/autohide .... so one could call it when he/she wants and be able to link/jump by standard windows drag/drop and shift/ctrl modification, which is not possible with the jump/link dialogue.

Originally posted by Leoram
3. The Link/Move dialog has an idiosyncrasy of its own (to my understanding) when dealing with linking or copying stuffs.
yes, like you choose store in Firefox and this dialogue still gives you an option to link, even though it will store anyway. So why do you list it here? Is that supposed to be advantage?

Originally posted by Leoram
4. Other uses I can't come up with now :).

maybe, because there is none?



So to sum it up, apart from the possibility to create an item and rename it before you import from another location, the whole link/move/import dialogue would be pretty USELESS

[eno]

I would also like the option of two data explorers panes in UR.

I am using Directory opus with its many options for file manipulation and two panes and find it superb, it can be customised almost as much as the user wants.

Kinook with Ultra Recall has to be carefull that it is usable for beginners as well as advanced users, on the one level it should be easy to use as clean installed, but there should be enough options so it does not limit the use of it as the users needs grow.

I am very pleased with the stability of UR and have been using it more and more.

I am not trying to say any suggestions others have made are not usefull or needed and just by reading all the postings as they come in I realise how wide the use and scope of UR is by the different way people use it.

For me the option of twin data explorers would put the icing on the cake.

[Leoram]

quant:

I'm not talking about the lack of meritoriousness of a second data explorer pane. I'm not putting it side by side with the Copy/Link dialog box either. I acknowledge that a 2nd explorer has potential good uses. I'm just stating in other words that the Copy/Link dialog is a feature that greatly benefit UR users. Remember that the dialog is still a toddler and has been recently introduced, so, we can think of it as a feature under development. It has some good potentials too (as I foresee it), and it's swiftly accessible (Alt+L, Esc to close it). In fact, the Copy/Link dialog is one of my top 10 features in UR, it's just that it's still a toddler.

[quant]

Originally posted by Leoram
It has some good potentials too (as I foresee it)
The potentials (as I see it) are those that are standard features of data explorer pane.
They added option to create new item and rename it in that dialogue. What's next? Choosing actually the template item you want to create instead of hardcoded folder? Be able to see and change the attributes? ...

Originally posted by Leoram
and it's swiftly accessible (Alt+L, Esc to close it)
The shortcuts could invoke/close second data explorer pane as well, if desirable ... no brainer

Originally posted by Leoram
In fact, the Copy/Link dialog is one of my top 10 features in UR, it's just that it's still a toddler.
my point was, that if developers consider second data explorer pane, then spending time on improving toddler would be waste of time because in the presence of second data explorer pane its usefulness would be very limited (as I see it, zero).

:-)

[Leoram]

Ok quant. I'll remain wishing that both cohabit in UR. There are many circumstances where a dialog would prove a more convenient option than using a second explorer pane, whereas there are still others probably where a 2nd explorer would be better. That's the way I see it. WebResearch, a competitor, has a very sleek dialog to accomplish the task of moving items, for example, where there's a search facility integrated in the dialog to access any Infoitem no matter how deep it is in the tree in a matter of a fraction of a second, the user proceeds then with the move. In the same dialog, the user can select another databases to perform the moving of the item. You may argue that a second data explorer could integrate these also but there would still be users who prefer the dialog, or both the dialog and the explorer. The combination of both would add to UltraRecall known tremendous flexibility. It's up to Kinook to consider what to do in this direction. I remain supporting the use of both as I see they complement each other for a heterogeneous community of UR users.

[quant]

Originally posted by Leoram
for example, where there's a search facility integrated in the dialog to access any Infoitem no matter how deep it is in the tree in a matter of a fraction of a second, the user proceeds then with the move.
geeez, when I was sarcastically listing what other things could be added to that dialogue, I didn't want to put SEARCH in that list, cause I thought that would be overkill even when as a sarcastic suggestion.

And you mention it in the next reply ;-)

Why oh why put search or any other feature there? Pressing ALT+L would prepare the item to be linked (with activating second explorer pane). I would suggest that mouse pointer would change (or something in status bar) to indicate that item(s) is/are prepared to be linked . Now do whatever you want to do in UR, search, add another items, order child items, go to item notes, bla bla bla, and then ... on whatever item (or collection of them) ... press keyboard shortcut or whatever that would confirm and link it. Or simply locate it in the second explorer pane as you'd do in the dialogue.

That's it, no need for bloated dialogue with hundreds of features.

100 people, 100 tastes ... I know :)

[janrif]

Originally posted by Leoram
[big snip] [snap?] I remain supporting the use of both as I see they complement each other for a heterogeneous community of UR users. I think I have to 2nd this sentiment. The usedfulness of a 2nd explorer pane should not preclude the usefulness of a more sophisticated copy/move/link dialog.

[quant]

Originally posted by janrif
I think I have to 2nd this sentiment.
That doesn't surprise me ;-)

copy/link/move are at heart very basic functions.

You choose the source, ...
... do whatever you want to do ...
... choose the destination

Now, what we are talking is "do whatever you want you to do". It seems as if you wanted to add all the features of UR to that dialogue, why?

I don't see any reason why the set of "do whatever you want to do" should be increased for that dialogue when everything is already available in the application itself. Please, provide some logical arguments. All those that Leoram stated are negated once the second data explorer pane is available.

Imagine that in the data explorer pane you have another search (whereas the full featured search pane already exists), another buttons to rename the item (this is just F2 or right click and choosing the proper option), to add it (there are already two buttons for that) ... it's all counter-intuitive.

[janrif]

Originally posted by quant
That doesn't surprise me ;-) [snip]
Then a further explanation shouldn't be necessary. ;-)